Recently the MCU has been experiencing a wobble, with their most recent movie The Marvels ending its box office run as the franchise's lowest-grossing film in history, whilst last year's TV show Secret Invasion was panned by critics and audiences alike, earning low Rotten Tomatoes scores in both categories.
But what is behind this trend? Have audience appetites altered? Has the quality of MCU shows and films hit a new low? Does it have something to do with one of Hollywood's favorite buzzwords right now – superhero fatigue?
Whilst catching up with director duo the Russo Brothers at the Sands: International Film Festival in St Andrews, Scotland last weekend, we asked the pair what they make of the current state of the MCU, given that it hasn't been the same since they helmed arguably the high point of that universe – Avengers: Endgame.
As Joe Russo told 12DOVE, he thinks that Marvel's current issues all come down to audiences changing, which in turn is due to a transformation in how the world now absorbs media. And it's not just affecting the MCU too in Hollywood, as he emphasized: "I think it's a reflection of the current state of everything. It's difficult right now, it's an interesting time. I think we're in a transitional period and people don't know quite yet how they're going to receive stories moving forward, or what kinds of stories they're going to want.
"There's a big generational divide about how you consume media. There's a generation that's used to appointment viewing and going to a theater on a certain date to see something, but it's ageing out. Meanwhile the new generation are 'I want it now, I want to process it now’, then moving onto the next thing, which they process whilst doing two other things at the same time. You know, it's a very different moment in time than it's ever been. And so I think everyone, including Marvel, is experiencing the same thing, this transition. And I think that really is probably what's at play more than anything else."
it's a very different moment in time than it's ever been. I think everyone, including Marvel, is experiencing the same transition.
Joe Russo
Continuing, Russo then stated that it's not just an issue the film and TV industry is facing, but the world in general – then highlighting that it's an incredibly difficult problem to address. As he said: "We have never collectively, globally, processed our conversation so intimately and quickly as we do now. I think that creates problems, where we over-process and don't care about context anymore. We communicate through memes and headlines, with nobody reading past two sentences, so everything's 100 characters or less – or 10-second videos on social media you swipe through. I think that the two-hour format, the structure that goes into making a movie, it’s over a century old now and everything always transitions. So, there is something happening again and that form is repetitive. But it's hard to reinvent that form and I think this next generation is looking for ways to tell their own stories that service their own sort of collective ADHD."
The pair also agree that they don't believe in the idea of superhero fatigue - with Anthony Russo pointing out that even if it was a problem, it's hardly a new one for cinema. As he explained: "I think it’s fatigue in general. The superhero fatigue question was around long before the work we were doing. So, it's sort of an eternal complaint, like we always used to cite this back in our early days with superhero work. People used to complain about westerns in the same way but they lasted for decades and decades and decades. They were continually reinvented and brought to new heights as they went on."
In addition to the above, another issue the industry is currently facing is AI with many questions being asked about what role this plays going forward. News stories such as horror movie Late Night With The Devil using AI to create some images for the film have attracted controversy, and that's only one example in an ever-growing list.
So, what do the Russo Brothers make of the current use of AI in Hollywood and what do they see the future of it being? For Joe Russo, it's all about who exactly is using it, as he explained: "We're always afraid of change but we always end up on the other side of it - and you can't stop AI. It's here and it's moving at a pace of weeks, not months or years. When we were at the festival last year and had a conversation about AI, it was somewhat controversial but there were no real stories about Chat GPT etc at that time and no Sora. So, it's going to move exponentially fast.
The trick, and the most important part of it, is getting in front of it, not being afraid of it, understanding it, and controlling it.
Joe Russo
"The trick, and the most important part of it, is getting in front of it, not being afraid of it, understanding it, and controlling it. Because if we lose control of the narrative, there are corporate entities who are going to be less concerned with the artists’ role in the future of media than artists standing up for themselves and protecting themselves. I think that’s the most important line in the sand to draw. Let's keep humans who control this stuff moving forward."
Agreeing with this brother, Anthony Russo then adds that he sees it in a similar way to how other new technologies were viewed in the past. As he concluded: "Our whole approach to it is – 'how do you use it as a creative tool?' In the same way that the iPhone is used as a creative tool. That was a new piece of technology that allowed people to communicate in ways they never could before. Steven Soderbergh shot a whole movie on it [2018's Unsane]. It’s the same with CG or Avid, or every other piece of technology. So that's our intersection point with it."
For more from our exclusive interview with the Russo Brothers, check out their reflections on Captain America: The Winter Soldier's 10th anniversary, what they can tease about their next movie The Electric State, their thoughts on Robert Downey Jr.'s recent comments about a return as Iron Man, and why they want to "build their own Star Wars".
Meanwhile for more from the world of the MCU, check out our guides to how to watch the Marvel movies in order and all of the upcoming Marvel movies and shows.
